shaddy58
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Reged: 06/07/2008
Posts: 3
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A great list but I would have included APOEL V. Omonia (Cyprus). This has everything - the nationalist, ant-Turkish support of APOEL v. the left-leaning, internationalist Che Guevara loving Omonia support (I am with Omonia on this by the way). I think they were once part of the same club but split following the post WWII uprising against British rule. I believe some of the APOEL players who joined the revolt were subsequently hanged by the British. There clashes are supposed to be something else.
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stephen_woodside
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Reged: 02/05/2007
Posts: 1880
Loc: Huyton, Merseyside
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I feel the word "Derby" has lost it's true meaning. The most disappointing issue for me is that locally knowadays on Merseyside, the "Derby" is regarded as Manchester United v Liverpool, caused by Liverpool fans cocksure attitude that a Merseyside derby is a cakewalk with the real test being against United. Gone are the days that the Everton v Liverpool match was seen one of the biggest and most famous derbies in Europe, a unique derby in which opposing fans can mingle. What actually is a "Derby ?" I dont see Liverpool v Manchester United, Real Madrid v Barcelona, Ajax v Feyernoord, Marseille v Paris Saint-Germain and Juventus v Fiorentina to name several, being "Derbies". Bitter Rivals yes but derbies, never. It is the ever changing ways of individual thoughts that lead to the misinterpretation of what means what. It therefore is a shame that those that compiled "The 50 greatest derbies in world football" entitled it as that. The list itself can not be faulted much, it just is entitled incorrectly.
-------------------- Nil Satis Nisi Optimum
Edited by stephen_woodside (07/07/2008 13:30)
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badgerboy
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Reged: 26/03/2007
Posts: 727
Loc: Bucks, England
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To be honest I think there is (or should be) a distinction between the terms "derby" and "local derby".
I suppose it's also down to translation. The Spanish speaking world seems to use the word "clįsico" to refer to matches between traditional rivals whatever the geography. And for me it would be very strange to have a list that didn't include Real Madrid v Barcelona just because they are geographically separate. For the English games I would consider Liverpool v Manchester United a "local rivalry" even if it isn't as local as the City derbies the clubs also play.
As for the rest of the list. I found the inclusion of a couple near the bottom (Tenerife v Las Palmas & Mohun Bagan v East Bengal) a bit strange. I'm also not entirely happy with Basle v Zurich and even less convinced by Beitar Jerusalem v Hapoel Tel Aviv or Juventus v Fiorentina.
Is Tenerife v Las Palmas (as an Island derby) really "bigger" than say the Sicilian Derby?
Is football in India really big enough to rate even their top teams a mention in the top 50 world derbies?
Don't Basle & Zurich just happen to be the top two teams in Swiss football at the moment (just the past couple of seasons) rather than there being any great historic rivalry that warrants inclusion on the list? I'd have been happier with Grasshoppers v Zurich as a proper local Swiss rivalry.
Beitar might have always been a pretty "big club" in Israeli football but they've only recently become one of the richest. I'd have thought Hapoel & Maccabi Tel Aviv would have been a far greater local rivalry for the fans.
And if Juventus v Torino wasn't big enough for inclusion I'd have thought that the Derby D'Italia (Juve v Inter) would have been a far more appropriate inclusion than Juve v Fiorentina. And yes I know Inter were already included once but Corinthians got two mentions.
Other games I might have considered including:
Dinamo Kiev v Shakhtar Donetsk from Ukraine. Not a local one but far more convincing to me as an example of two dominant teams going at each other than Basle v Zurich.
Esperance v Club Africain. I would imagine this is the biggest African game not included on the list.
Hearts of Oak v Asante Kotoko. Again not a "local" rivalry but Ghana's two heavyweight teams.
Sporting v Benfica. Although Benfica v Porto was already included I'd have thought that the Lisbon Derby on it's own was still pretty huge (at worst worthy of a mention in the Benfica-Porto piece).
Actually one idea for what WS should do to replace it's "Non-FIFA Footballing countries" pieces - which must surely be reaching a natural end soon - is "Lesser known Football Derbies". So you might do a two-page spread on a whole country - picking four or five of the "best of the rest" or you might do more detail on just one particular rivalry.
So if you did England you might do a whole piece on the "Second City Derby" - including some stats (overall record, attendance figures etc) but mostly talking about the biggest games between the two & what created the rivalry & keeps it burning. Or you might do this on a smaller scale but with similar info. on the Tyne-Wear Derby, Steel City Derby & one other. I assume non-UK readers would know a lot less about such rivalries.
Going further afield you might look at somewhere like Bulgaria & consider rivalries with & between the lesser Sofia teams (Slavia & Lokomotiv) plus games like the Plovdiv, Varna & Bourgas Derbies. I know these rivalries exist but I have no idea how big they are (or have been historically).
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shaddy58
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Reged: 06/07/2008
Posts: 3
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You got me racking my brains now 'badgerboy' with your suggestions - although they hardly play each other I suppose Hamburger SV v. St Pauli would be pretty tasty
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ubeep
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Reged: 04/07/2008
Posts: 12
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I was suprised at their only being 3 British games in the list.
English club football is lauded as the biggest and best yet we saw only Spurs v Arsenal and Liverpool v Man Utd, and they were both well down the list.
How about Chelsea v Arsenal as a Rivalry or The Merseyside, Manchester or Birmingham Derbies - All Massive games with a great deal of history.
Spurs V West Ham is another with alot of tension on and off the pitch. The Tyne-Wear Derby, Leeds Utd v Man Utd (or Chelsea) though haven't been played recently due to Leeds woes are still huge games that run deeper than just football.
North of the border the Edinburgh derby might of got a mention somewhere down the list as well
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