stephen_woodside
member
Reged: 02/05/2007
Posts: 1880
Loc: Huyton, Merseyside
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So the draw for the third round qualifying draw as just been made in Nyon. Yet again it emphasises many flaws. The draw is over complicated even for qualifed neuro-surgeons let alone the everyday football fan. Also what is obviously evident is that the draw is constructed in a way that any club that cannot put any great profit into UEFA's coffers will be given little chance to progress. With the exception of the Schalke 04 v Atletico Madrid clash, it looks a well thought out draw to suit the money men.
Third qualifying round draw
Anorthosis/Rapid Vienna v Olympiakos
Vitoria Guimaraes v IFK Gothenburg/Basel
Shakhtar Donetsk v Domzale/Dinamo Zagreb
Schalke 04 v Atletico Madrid
Aalborg/Modrica v RANGERS/Kaunas
Barcelona v Beitar Jerusalem/Wisla Krakow
Levski Sofia v Anderlecht/BATE
Standard Liege v LIVERPOOL
Inter Baku/Partizan v Fenerbahce/MTK Budapest
FC Twente v ARSENAL
Spartak Moscow v Drogheda/Dinamo Kiev
Juventus v Tampere/Artmedia
SK Brann/Ventspils v Marseille
Fiorentina v Slavia Prague
Galatasaray v Steaua Bucharest
Panathinaikos/Dinamo Tbilisi v Sheriff Tiraspol/Sparta Prague
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Nil Satis Nisi Optimum
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Rogorn
member
Reged: 24/03/2007
Posts: 314
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Rangers' elimination in the second preliminary round today has revealed a flaw in UEFA's draw system. Why did it have to be conducted with the second legs of the previous round still to play? If there are surprise results like this one, then some seeded teams could have changed, producing important differences in the draw.
Now one from FB Kaunas, Modrica or Aalborg will get into the Champions League proper, and whoever the winner, they won't be one of the top 32 teams in Europe by any means. In the meantime Schalke or Atlético won't even start it.
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stephen_woodside
member
Reged: 02/05/2007
Posts: 1880
Loc: Huyton, Merseyside
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Quote:
Rangers' elimination in the second preliminary round today has revealed a flaw in UEFA's draw system. Why did it have to be conducted with the second legs of the previous round still to play? If there are surprise results like this one, then some seeded teams could have changed, producing important differences in the draw.
Now one from FB Kaunas, Modrica or Aalborg will get into the Champions League proper, and whoever the winner, they won't be one of the top 32 teams in Europe by any means. In the meantime Schalke or Atlético won't even start it.
To be honest, it is about time we had underdogs "so-called" smaller teams in the Champions League proper. I have repeated myself time and time again, but i feel the Champions of each nation should be allowed to enter, afterall it is called the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE. Rangers, Seville and Atletico Bilbao only have themselves to blame for not being there simply due to there only failure.
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Nil Satis Nisi Optimum
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gonch
member
Reged: 03/12/2007
Posts: 17
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I have looked into this in an article on my site Just-Football for anyone interested.
http://www.just-football.com/2008/08/uefa-champions-league-plus-change.html
Keen to hear your thoughts either here or on the site, as to whether or not you feel the Champions League is becoming a bit too samey. I was surprised to see Rangers knocked out, but personally I am glad as it will add to the diversity of the competition having one of Kaunas, Aalborg or Modrica in there. Even if they do get hopelessly eliminated in the group stages, the financial boost of 6 Champions League games will massively help the club that qualifies, spreading the wealth around a bit.
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www.just-football.com
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Rogorn
member
Reged: 24/03/2007
Posts: 314
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I'm for the best 32 in the continent, wherever they come from. Like in any national league. Failing that, the current system is quite OK.
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reddevil82
member
Reged: 27/06/2008
Posts: 67
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Even though the performances of Premier League and La Liga clubs have proven the strength of the third and fourth-place clubs, the perennial qualification of the same clubs does give the competition the feel of a European League. I would restrict qualification to runners-up as the likes of Wisla, Standard and Dinamo Zagreb can never make real progress if constantly drawn against the wealthy elite.
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Rogorn
member
Reged: 24/03/2007
Posts: 314
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I've just watched FC Barcelona beat Wisla Kraków 4-0 at home in a very Barça-like way. And if I tell you that the scorers were Xavi Hernández, Thierry Henry and two from Samuel Eto'o, I'm sure you can picture what their goals have been like. Eto'o opened and closed the scoring by outrunning his defender, collecting a through-ball and shooting past the keeper, Xavi thumped his from outside the box, and Henry made it 3-0 with one of his ultra-cool glide-away-from-marker-then-chip-the-keeper (non) efforts.
With no proper number 9 among the tactical plans this season, Eto'o staying at the Nou Camp must be nominated for best piece of business, and it would be a certain winner if it didn't turn out to be that after so much milling of rumours all summer, everyone except Ronaldinho is staying put. Josep Guardiola has everything to prove as manager, but at least he has shown that he doesn't hold grudges (Leo Messi escaping to Beijing is another sticky matter he's dealt very well with), and that his main aim is to put on the field the best 11 players his club has under signature, whichever way they got there. He's got all the makings of a players' manager, and as the original local-boy-good-enough-to-play-among-a-glamorous-international-galaxy he will have the full support of the fans.
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tko999
member
Reged: 13/06/2008
Posts: 11
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Liverpool's game against Liege looks like a banana skin. I can see it finishing in a score draw...
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stephen_woodside
member
Reged: 02/05/2007
Posts: 1880
Loc: Huyton, Merseyside
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A 1-1 draw would do be nicely but seriously, i felt Liege had there chance in the 1st leg and should have took a lead to Anfield. The way Liverpool are playing at the moment, a shock maybe on the cards but i cant see it happening. Despite Liverpool not performing well lately, they still have been grinding out results which is a sign of a team that will do well "unfortunately".
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Nil Satis Nisi Optimum
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Rogorn
member
Reged: 24/03/2007
Posts: 314
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A: Chelsea, Roma, Bordeaux, Cluj
B: Inter, Bremen, Panathinaikos, Anorthosis
C: Barcelona, Sporting, Basel, Shakhtar
D: Liverpool, PSV, Marseille, Atlético
E: Man U, Villarreal, Celtic, Aalborg
F: Lyon, Bayern, Steaua, Fiorentina
G: Arsenal, Porto, Fenerbahçe, Dynamo Kiev
H: Real Madrid, Juventus, Zenit, BATE
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thrall
member
Reged: 02/09/2007
Posts: 217
Loc: Turkey - Istanbul
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For me Group D and G seems fairly balanced, Chelsea and Roma are favorites to qualify in group A like Inter and Bremen in Group b. Barcelona surely is going to top the group, the competition for the second place will be close. The team who gets some points from Barca will have the advantage to take that second place.
In Group E Villareal and Celtic is going to battle to qualify, i don`t give a chance to Aalborg, even for the UEFA CUP. In Group G: Bayern and Lyon are favorites but Fiorentina and Steaua have the potential to stun them. Group H is a tough group, if Zenit can win their games at home against Juve and Real, anything can happen. Because Juve and Real will be merciless against each other. Bate has no chance even for a 3rd place.
And for the group D where my team fenerbahce is going to play :
Arsenal Porto Fenerbahce and D.Kiev. ARsenal is the pot 1 team here but i`m sure most of you can`t say Arsenal is going to the top the group for sure. Against Fenerbahce and Porto when they`ll be playing away from home, they have to work real hard. Fenerbahce didn`t even draw a single game in the champion`s league last season and this season at home where they played against the likes of Inter,Sevilla and Chelsea. Porto plays very well at home as well. I expect Porto and Fener to compete for a qualification in this group, Kiev have potential to surprise any opponents and grab some points. Even the competition for the 3rd place will be tough in this group. I hope we can see some wonderful games this season, and good luck to every club who participate in this competition.
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http://footballarticlesofthrall.blogspot.com
Edited by thrall (28/08/2008 18:44)
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Stiglitz
member
Reged: 21/12/2007
Posts: 2
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GROUP G
Fenerbahce and Arsenal will be fighting for the top spot. Porto seems weaker than last year. Quaresma is on the way to Inter, also they lost a key player, Bosingwa. On the other hand Europe will meet with Hulk, their new forward from Tokyo Verde. Nevertheless Arsenal and Fenerbahce will be too good for Porto. Arsenal can not replace Hleb. He was very talented, not easy to find the same quality. Fenerbahce upgraded the front line with La Liga top scorer " Guiza " instead of instead of Serbian poor formed, Kezman. Also Josico (DM) from Villareal and Emre (CM) from Newcastle have been transfered. However Aurelio (DM)seems to be a serious loss unless Josico contributes with a solid performance.
Arsenal and Fenerbahce will probably lose no points home. The one who takes more points from Porto will take the lead of the group.
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das
member
Reged: 19/05/2007
Posts: 53
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GOING BACK TO WHAT WOODSIDE SAID EARLIER, THE COMPETITION IS CALLED THE CHAMPIONS LEAGUE AND THEREFORE TEAMS FINISHING 2ND,3RD ETC SHOULD NOT EVEN BE CONSIDERED FOR IT! REGARDLESS FROM WHERE UR FROM AND WHAT LEAGUE U WIN, U SHOULDNT HAVE PLAY IN PRELIMINARY ROUNDS BUT GAIN AUTOMATIC ENTRY INTO THE GROUP STAGES. THE SYSTEM NEEDS TO LOOKED AT TO BNEFIT SMALLER TEAMS !
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Rogorn
member
Reged: 24/03/2007
Posts: 314
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I strongly oppose that. Thankfully, it will never happen again.
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das
member
Reged: 19/05/2007
Posts: 53
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The point is that its not very fair that the champions from one country must play the third placed team from another country to play in the CHAMPIONS league. Thats not exactly fair is it now ?
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Rogorn
member
Reged: 24/03/2007
Posts: 314
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If that 'champion from one country' is a better team than 'the third-placed team from another country', surely the former will beat the latter over two legs, won't they?
If that does not happen (Barcelona v Wisla, for example), then who deserves it most?
I think exactly the opposite: that it's not very fair that a better-quality team, like the fifth-placed club from Spain or England, have to be left out when they're much better than many league champions from other countries. If there's no limit no the number of clubs from London in the Premier League, for example, nor the West Country is guaranteed a team in it, then why do we want that rule in the Champions League? Imagine Tottenham, Fulham, Charlton, West Ham and co being barred from the Premiership because Arsenal and Chelsea block their path. That wouldn't be fair, would it?
As it is now, at least one team from each and every nation has a fair crack at it every year. And if you're deserving of it, you will get there. Look at Anorthosis this year, who have got there by beating a proper Champions League club like Olympiacos. What I didn't like was the path Aalborg had after Kaunas beat Rangers, for example, while Schalke and Atlético were paired together. The seeds should have been rearranged for the following round draw.
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stephen_woodside
member
Reged: 02/05/2007
Posts: 1880
Loc: Huyton, Merseyside
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My argument is quite simple really, how are club sides that win their respective leagues able to progess further when they dont make it to the UEFA Champions League proper. Indeed why call it the "Champions League"? Surely that is false advertising which is why i wish they would change the name of the competition. Why UEFA do not wish to allow so-called lesser teams into the Champions League is quite clear, they feel they would lose money and attract less viewers. My team Everton qualified for the UEFA Cup which i am again pleased but in reallity, why should we qualify for Europe when we finished in 5th place. In my ideal world, i would love to see the Cup Winners Cup return for each of the National Cup winners from each European nation while the UEFA Cup representitives where those that come second in their domestic Leagues and the Champions obviously fought for the "CHAMPIONS" League. Unfortunately, we dont live in an ideal world, we live in a world where the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Football is no different than life itself.
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Nil Satis Nisi Optimum
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PETRALDO
member
Reged: 06/09/2008
Posts: 2
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I THINK PANATHINAIKOS WILL TAKE THE ONE OF THE 2 TICKETS
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tko999
member
Reged: 13/06/2008
Posts: 11
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Taking Rogorn's lead re: the FIFA 2010 World Cup website, perhaps members might be interested in the UEFA Champion's League website...
http://www.uefa.com/competitions/ucl/index.html
Worth a look
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Mark_Knows
member
Reged: 02/10/2008
Posts: 1
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The current exact chances to qualify for the next round are:
1. Liverpool 89.6% (46% to finish 1st)
2. Real Madrid 89.3% (61.3% to finish 1st)
3. Atletico Madrid 89.3% (51% to finish 1st)
4. Barcelona 87.1% (62.9% to finish 1st).
How do I know this?: www.officialodds.net
...and what do you think?
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